well Gibbo you are right i will never apologize for doing nothing wrong and that you can take to the bank.
secondly when i went there i had no idea whose server it was, i just went there to play
and thirdly maybe they should apologize for thier crude behavior.
and finally if they were upset over some incident in BSk over 2 years ago that really bothered them like losing a PvP battle well maybe they shouldn't be playing this game in the first place let alone hosting a server.
The Newcastle Server
Moderators: DM_eaze, Luceran, DM_Jaydaan, ST_DM_Myle, dm_xeen1, DM Nexus, DM_TrainWrek, Carpe_DM1, DM_Unicorn, DM_Griphon, DM_Shadowlands, dm_zane, DM_Centaur, DM_Mystic, DM Rendyll, DM_Avalon
Wouldn't it make you the bigger man to try and seek out reconciliation, no matter if you're in the wrong or not, then to point fingers and continue a rather pointless feud war? If you extend a genuine olive branch of peace and it is still slapped away, then you've done all you can do.
If they're in the wrong, then you'd need to exercise forgiveness. If you're in the wrong, then you'd need to exercise reconciliation. I'll even go so far as to appeal to the Second Testament: WWJD?
There's been a lot of huff and puff over these people... and while I don't pretend to understand the whole context of the situation and the relationships interwoven between them, no one has really stepped up to take productive action to setting aside differences.
If they're in the wrong, then you'd need to exercise forgiveness. If you're in the wrong, then you'd need to exercise reconciliation. I'll even go so far as to appeal to the Second Testament: WWJD?
There's been a lot of huff and puff over these people... and while I don't pretend to understand the whole context of the situation and the relationships interwoven between them, no one has really stepped up to take productive action to setting aside differences.
ZOMFGOMBIES!
-
wdpepsiman
- Count
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Tue Jul 04, 2006 4:51 pm
I'll have you know that I go out of my way to be politically incorrect. And I have the right to straddle whatever I want... as long as there's proper consent.
Peps. Can I call you peps? You do have a tendency to come off sometimes as... blunt? Insulting? Cold? Short tempered? Condescending? Intolerably difficult... I think you can really pick any of those. Your "Hey, what's in the past is in the past, no hard feelings" may seem like to others as "You're a baby, shut up and stop straddling the fence."
Just saying, if you're satisfied you've done all you can to be the good guy in this, then that's all you can do.
Peps. Can I call you peps? You do have a tendency to come off sometimes as... blunt? Insulting? Cold? Short tempered? Condescending? Intolerably difficult... I think you can really pick any of those. Your "Hey, what's in the past is in the past, no hard feelings" may seem like to others as "You're a baby, shut up and stop straddling the fence."
Just saying, if you're satisfied you've done all you can to be the good guy in this, then that's all you can do.
ZOMFGOMBIES!
-
wdpepsiman
- Count
- Posts: 105
- Joined: Tue Jul 04, 2006 4:51 pm
yes and aren't those lovely qualities to have and at least you know where i stand.
didn't mean for you to take any of this personally and i do understand your point of view trying to be a peacmaker and all.
no hard feelings.
oh and can i call you gibby
well this is the last i will post on this matter
didn't mean for you to take any of this personally and i do understand your point of view trying to be a peacmaker and all.
no hard feelings.
oh and can i call you gibby
well this is the last i will post on this matter
Very rarely will I take something personally.. Typically, one has to actually say 'Take this personally!--' before finishing the rest of their sentence for me to get the clue. The only hard feelings I'd have for you is if I were to be say... straddling at the same time. ^_- oh ho ho so naughty.
Feel free to call me gibby, but there's a disclosure with that... Hordack calls me gibby -____- if you want to be thrown in the same category as him, go for it. lol
Feel free to call me gibby, but there's a disclosure with that... Hordack calls me gibby -____- if you want to be thrown in the same category as him, go for it. lol
ZOMFGOMBIES!
-
Pretty Fly White Guy
- Duke
- Posts: 1350
- Joined: Tue Jul 04, 2006 4:40 pm
- Location: Yorkshire
- Contact:
Ah, Gibbs, you made this entire forum thread worthwhile. From the beginning I thought it was going to be entirely pointless and in the end just a bunch of sour grapes trying to make wine, but they end up with whine instead.
But you came down and turned the tides and made it all laughable. See, a college education IS useful! I'm sure it all boils down to those people who were expelled from kindergarten are just jealous over our fine educating. Booya! Bring on the fences, baby!
But you came down and turned the tides and made it all laughable. See, a college education IS useful! I'm sure it all boils down to those people who were expelled from kindergarten are just jealous over our fine educating. Booya! Bring on the fences, baby!
-
ST_DM_Myle
- Viceroy
- Posts: 1043
- Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2006 7:38 am
- Location: In the lingering darknes behind you.
- Contact:
There are some game styles and personality sets that just do not mix well.
Sometimes it is better just to leave well enough alone and just agree to disagree.
After all, NWN offers many sandboxes for people to play in and each sandbox has it's own customs and expectations of those who visit.
I do not personally prescribe to the ideology that a person should be auto-banned on log-in, unless they are someone I have either personally banned or supported in a vote to ban elsewhere (such as here on BSK). Even then, people who have been banned are generally extended the oppurtunity to contact me in e-mail and request access again.
However, my way of doing things is just that.... my way. Different admins have their own way of doing things. Driller managed BSK in his way. Dorrian manages NC in his way. Neph manages Amia in her way...
This is part of what is great about NWN PW's.... Owners/admins have the ability to run things in the way they are most comfortable.
As players, we have many many options between all these PW's and if players still are not happy, they can make their own PW.
Myle
Sometimes it is better just to leave well enough alone and just agree to disagree.
After all, NWN offers many sandboxes for people to play in and each sandbox has it's own customs and expectations of those who visit.
I do not personally prescribe to the ideology that a person should be auto-banned on log-in, unless they are someone I have either personally banned or supported in a vote to ban elsewhere (such as here on BSK). Even then, people who have been banned are generally extended the oppurtunity to contact me in e-mail and request access again.
However, my way of doing things is just that.... my way. Different admins have their own way of doing things. Driller managed BSK in his way. Dorrian manages NC in his way. Neph manages Amia in her way...
This is part of what is great about NWN PW's.... Owners/admins have the ability to run things in the way they are most comfortable.
As players, we have many many options between all these PW's and if players still are not happy, they can make their own PW.
Myle
LoT-zine©
-
Capt Cliff
- Duke
- Posts: 1097
- Joined: Sun Oct 22, 2006 3:22 pm
Hordy, I didn't say it was you ... but that's why I stopped coming. You always played on the up and up. A bit frightening at first considering your rep on BSK. I liked Windhill and how it was set up but the weird stuff in town with DM's killing toons for no reason except he was DM put me off. I might peak in sometime in the future. I like the houses and the forge.Hordack wrote:Mr Cliff
Strange you never brought this issue up with a Admin or anyone, and I am sorry you experience wasn't as you liked it. Next time speak up so we can fix the issue and problem.I stopped going to Windhill when the DM's went wonky ... all the BS in town and killing people ... too much for me .... adios Windhill
An for my defenders of NewCastle ... well what can I say? I am glad I am banned cause way things look I rather play on BSK2 and Windhill and I sure Driller will give me another 3.5 years of good fun with nwn2 and I have my friends on Windhill. Me personaly I have nothing more to say on this subject.
And this Myle is why I believe NewCastle will have their little "click" of players and that will be it. It may get a small up-tick due to BSK changing to NWN2, but it will settle down to just their group. Anywhere someone is banned due to issues on another server (aka another world IC) is ridiculous.ST_DM_Myle wrote:There are some game styles and personality sets that just do not mix well.
I do not personally prescribe to the ideology that a person should be auto-banned on log-in, unless they are someone I have either personally banned or supported in a vote to ban elsewhere (such as here on BSK). Even then, people who have been banned are generally extended the oppurtunity to contact me in e-mail and request access again.
However, my way of doing things is just that.... my way. Different admins have their own way of doing things. Driller managed BSK in his way. Dorrian manages NC in his way. Neph manages Amia in her way...
This is part of what is great about NWN PW's.... Owners/admins have the ability to run things in the way they are most comfortable.
As players, we have many many options between all these PW's and if players still are not happy, they can make their own PW.
Myle
Maybe I'm too used to Driller's "let bygones be bygones" attitude and allowing many types of players to come and make BSK their home. Restricting a server's player base to only a few people who share the same exact beliefs will not make for a fun crowded server for the masses. Having DM's who ban people so quickly isn't fun to anyone other than the DM's and the best buddies of the DM's.
Maybe small is what they are shooting for and that's for them to decide.
I'm sure Queen Naga, Beth Hall and the NewC people will be happy there. From my experiences on NC it's like walking into the Twilight Zone movie.
Some 4th dimension, BSK parallel universe. The ripoffs are all too common. I wonder if Driller got a copyright for his material? Yes, he helps people with scripting questions.......I'm sure the questions from this group were "Wow that script to do blah blah blah is so amazing. How did you do that?". I like to call it blowing smoke up someone's skirt, and using them for what you want.
From the person's post about them already taking over another MOD, I feel very certain this NewC server has been in the works (as in moooching off Driller's ideas and scripting) for quite some time........apparently right after they acted like a bunch of babies about having their a$$es handed to them on BSK.
I'd rather be tried by 12 than carried by 6.
-
ST_DM_Myle
- Viceroy
- Posts: 1043
- Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2006 7:38 am
- Location: In the lingering darknes behind you.
- Contact:
I understand what you mean GoVols, but if I have banned someone here on BSK and they make no attempt at restitution... why should I open the door on LoT?
While it is on a different scale - if I welcome someone over for dinner and their manners are so poor that I kick them out, I certianly would not invite them over my new place if ther has been no sign of a change in their manners.
On that same measure, if someone contacts me and seems genuine in their apology for the issues that led to thembeing banned, then a dialogue can start and lifting the ban becomes possible.
Now, there are a list of BSK players who are on the "watch list" if they show up on LoT. As it stands I do not have any standing auto-bans for anyone. However, the people on the "watch list" will only get a single warning. I am not as tolerant as Driller. As gruff as he can be about things, he (to my thinking) would rather give 'one more try' in the spirit of forgiveness than just draw a hard line. He really seems to try to avoid drawing many hard lines.
I would rather have clearly defined, up front expectations and if people breach our rules on LoT, they are dealt with in a progressive progress (depending on severity):
Warning, Character Deletion/Wipe, Temp Ban and then a Perm Ban...
There have been times when we offered warnings then advanced straight to a ban, but we give people the chance to adjust to the expectations we have on LoT. Nothing is sprung on a player.
On NC, they have their own standard. Sure, it may not match BSK, LoT, or the standards that individual players may like, but it is their right to apply their preferences. Will their specific actions hurt their server? Maybe, maybe not... but thats not the point. If they are running a server for the express purpose of being all things to all people - then all they will get in the end will be frustration.
Their server will best meet the needs of their target audience if they run the world in a manner in which the Admins and DM's are the most comfortable. If their audience turns out to be a small niche of players who all have fun and enjoy their time together.... then their a success. Having a full server is not necessarily a sign of success, especially if the server team is unhappy with the type of playerbase they end up with.
In summary, I think they should have pulled the players in question aside and explained their concerns with their play style and that if those traits are expressed on their server, that bans would be issued. But my opinion does not matter in this case. The NC team clearly choose to not even put the issue on the table and that is their right.
Nobody has to like it. Nobody have to respect it. But every server has the option to invite or refuse anybody, for any reason, be that reason real or imagined.
Myle
While it is on a different scale - if I welcome someone over for dinner and their manners are so poor that I kick them out, I certianly would not invite them over my new place if ther has been no sign of a change in their manners.
On that same measure, if someone contacts me and seems genuine in their apology for the issues that led to thembeing banned, then a dialogue can start and lifting the ban becomes possible.
Now, there are a list of BSK players who are on the "watch list" if they show up on LoT. As it stands I do not have any standing auto-bans for anyone. However, the people on the "watch list" will only get a single warning. I am not as tolerant as Driller. As gruff as he can be about things, he (to my thinking) would rather give 'one more try' in the spirit of forgiveness than just draw a hard line. He really seems to try to avoid drawing many hard lines.
I would rather have clearly defined, up front expectations and if people breach our rules on LoT, they are dealt with in a progressive progress (depending on severity):
Warning, Character Deletion/Wipe, Temp Ban and then a Perm Ban...
There have been times when we offered warnings then advanced straight to a ban, but we give people the chance to adjust to the expectations we have on LoT. Nothing is sprung on a player.
On NC, they have their own standard. Sure, it may not match BSK, LoT, or the standards that individual players may like, but it is their right to apply their preferences. Will their specific actions hurt their server? Maybe, maybe not... but thats not the point. If they are running a server for the express purpose of being all things to all people - then all they will get in the end will be frustration.
Their server will best meet the needs of their target audience if they run the world in a manner in which the Admins and DM's are the most comfortable. If their audience turns out to be a small niche of players who all have fun and enjoy their time together.... then their a success. Having a full server is not necessarily a sign of success, especially if the server team is unhappy with the type of playerbase they end up with.
In summary, I think they should have pulled the players in question aside and explained their concerns with their play style and that if those traits are expressed on their server, that bans would be issued. But my opinion does not matter in this case. The NC team clearly choose to not even put the issue on the table and that is their right.
Nobody has to like it. Nobody have to respect it. But every server has the option to invite or refuse anybody, for any reason, be that reason real or imagined.
Myle
-
ST_DM_Myle
- Viceroy
- Posts: 1043
- Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2006 7:38 am
- Location: In the lingering darknes behind you.
- Contact:
On the issue of NC being like BSK:
LOL... yes, there are similarities, but there are a lot of differences also. Lets face it, if something works: why fix it.
I have no personal stake in NC's success or failure. Actually, if someone looks at it like a competition, it would serve my purposes if they failed. I do not look at the NWN community in that fashion though. I prefer to take the view of mutual friendship, encouragement and exchange of ideas. After all, even the biggest NWN servers can only host 99/99. With thousands and thousands of players... there are plenty of players and no reason to stoop the point of bickering over them.
BSK is clearly an strong influence on NC, but most of the server ( that I have seen) is wholey original and they have scripts and features that are not part of BSK. Some of thier rules come right off the work I did here, which does not bother me at all. If my hard work here can help others save a few steps developing their own policies, then I am glad.
Now I have not been far into NC and I have only given their forums a few quick looks, but I did not notice any offering of credits (which may be a point of justifiable contention). That said, not everything about BSK was exactly original either.
Driller himself touted the tributes within BSK to Diablo, BG and other gaming classics. Demeaning NC for adopting successful ideas just because your not pleased with the server admin is not consistant unless your going to also hold other server admins to the same harsh standards.
All in all..... Imitation is, after all, the highest form of flattery.
Myle
LOL... yes, there are similarities, but there are a lot of differences also. Lets face it, if something works: why fix it.
I have no personal stake in NC's success or failure. Actually, if someone looks at it like a competition, it would serve my purposes if they failed. I do not look at the NWN community in that fashion though. I prefer to take the view of mutual friendship, encouragement and exchange of ideas. After all, even the biggest NWN servers can only host 99/99. With thousands and thousands of players... there are plenty of players and no reason to stoop the point of bickering over them.
BSK is clearly an strong influence on NC, but most of the server ( that I have seen) is wholey original and they have scripts and features that are not part of BSK. Some of thier rules come right off the work I did here, which does not bother me at all. If my hard work here can help others save a few steps developing their own policies, then I am glad.
Now I have not been far into NC and I have only given their forums a few quick looks, but I did not notice any offering of credits (which may be a point of justifiable contention). That said, not everything about BSK was exactly original either.
Driller himself touted the tributes within BSK to Diablo, BG and other gaming classics. Demeaning NC for adopting successful ideas just because your not pleased with the server admin is not consistant unless your going to also hold other server admins to the same harsh standards.
All in all..... Imitation is, after all, the highest form of flattery.
Myle
Ah, Myle. Always a voice of reason. I was just thinking that there would be a case for driller to come up with a lawsuit to Origin Systems for their use of his concept to the Runes and either them or EA for their blatant use of the name Skara Brae in their games. The audacity!!!
And can you believe that other games shamelessly use portals to other parts of the world?
I know there are COUNTLESS games that have stolen that idea from driller. Jeez, and need we mention the number of people who have shamelessly stolen the ideas of CRAFTING weapons and armor to make them more powerful?!? My GOD, this is just terrible! Plagiarism at its absolute worst!!
So, I'm going to have to throw in my support of all of you who are so adamant to say that Newcastle is a copy of BSK. My only thought on the issue is to leave the little fish to fry.
Driller, you should immediately contact a lawyer and start suing the big boys. My goodness, it is absolutely ridiculous that they can get away with such things.
*rolls eyes* Come on people, GROW UP! You don't like it, fine. You think you were mistreated? If you're whining about it so profusely, you probably deserved your bans. Suck it up and go elsewhere with your precious individuality and your need to develop your 733T skills of powergaming and your perfect RP that NEVER is wrong.
I do have to say, this thread and many others since the announcement of BSK's demise have shed a lot of light on the true colors of BSK. The petty crap, the out of control drama and the need to attack and insult others. It makes me sick.
And can you believe that other games shamelessly use portals to other parts of the world?
I know there are COUNTLESS games that have stolen that idea from driller. Jeez, and need we mention the number of people who have shamelessly stolen the ideas of CRAFTING weapons and armor to make them more powerful?!? My GOD, this is just terrible! Plagiarism at its absolute worst!!
So, I'm going to have to throw in my support of all of you who are so adamant to say that Newcastle is a copy of BSK. My only thought on the issue is to leave the little fish to fry.
Driller, you should immediately contact a lawyer and start suing the big boys. My goodness, it is absolutely ridiculous that they can get away with such things.
*rolls eyes* Come on people, GROW UP! You don't like it, fine. You think you were mistreated? If you're whining about it so profusely, you probably deserved your bans. Suck it up and go elsewhere with your precious individuality and your need to develop your 733T skills of powergaming and your perfect RP that NEVER is wrong.
I do have to say, this thread and many others since the announcement of BSK's demise have shed a lot of light on the true colors of BSK. The petty crap, the out of control drama and the need to attack and insult others. It makes me sick.