Cajin wrote:In short: I would love to be able to settle a IC score in the keep but again WITH CONSENT of both me and the other.
the Idea is a nice one but since there are those who start to whack at you on sight I do so wish that there would be given some thought of what to do with them l33t players (personally, I hate those from out of my toes)
Over the years I have seen and been on when these things happen. I have tried to help if I am not in a rp at time or I ask others to help the person out. But your right it happens a lot and will happen more in the Keep if it was PVP. There needs to be a area where new folks can get to know others so they can party up. If you go straight out there is no time to get to know folks.
The other servers I went to PVP right off the bat and no one to help you out. That equals I'm not going to stay on this server.
Another thing half of those on that list do NOT just auto kill folks in other areas unless there is a reason to do so such as PPing or Kill stealing or they were attacked first.
Most on that list go to the arena or another agreed area to duel. I will say a few have killed folks for little reason.
Jazelle wrote:Another thing half of those on that list do NOT just auto kill folks in other areas unless there is a reason to do so such as PPing or Kill stealing or they were attacked first.
Most on that list go to the arena or another agreed area to duel. I will say a few have killed folks for little reason.
True, my PvP's always are in quiet area's and take time since it's a RP scene....mind you, I did wish sometimes that a conflict/ brawl between char's IC could be done in the keep instead of having to say "to the hamlet with you! I'll smash yer face there ya git!"
- Cajin "The Reborn"
- Kelth and William McEwann
- Ghûrzhazh Rhânanûr
-Duncan "The Hunk" Mackinlay
I enjoy rp and I support pvp in the keep. There are many times when my characters have been provoked in the keep and Saphire especially would have killed them but I have to play nice, which she is not, because of the no pvp in the keep rule and alter her character. It doesn't matter that she would probably be killed but when I rp, I rp that character as she or he (Remy) is. I'm not going to run around killing newbies, but if my character would attack due to provocation, it would be nice if they could.
Saphire
Jaylor Holliday
Remy LeBeau
Deva
Red Sonja
Topanga Goldleaf
There is no reason they can't. The dice bags are good for in Keep happenings. Hell one time Orty beat the fool out of a thief and we used the dice back. Her staff is often used as a club.
May RPs that I have been in we have used the dice bag and skill rolls to frankly do things you can't even with pvp. While you won't over step the issue there are others who will.
I have seen it happen on servers and I have seen stuff that really would of gotten out of hand with the players stopped from happening due to the Keep's Non setting. Things that DMs toke care of and would of been much worse if the settings had not been there.
Do not think I can not see both sides. I do. I understand the frustration not being able to deal with a player who is being an ass and upsetting one rp after another. I also know how to deal with them and not change the settings.
I just don't see any benfit and pretty much see a lot of harm changing the settings as they are now.
As for rps again it depends on the players and how go they are at telling a story and keeping folks attention. Many very good rps are gone for reasons that vary. There are many current rpers I do not know nore have I found a reason to rp with them - yet.
And yes there are some folks I just don't wish to rp with for my own reasons. Often as not as has been stated before someone who is good at rping will get swamped. You can only read so fast and with around 10 folks trying to get their point across it is hard to answer everyone.
Some folks get missed or the answer that is finally given is around 40 lines later after the person answered others. Often folks don't leave enough time for another to even say hello.
If you ask a long question that took you a min or two to write remember it is going to take another person a few mins to read, digest then start to answer. You can't count to 3 and expect a full indepth responce.
Often I have seen folks forget this is not voice and not everyone is a great typer, speaks the same language or that they might be fielding other tells first before being able to answer.
Or you get the folks who field all their rp with a ton of // ooc info and comments right afterwards. The chat screen is only so big and every line will pop that screen up and out of the person's field of vision.
You get a bunch of folks all talking at onces and well I'm lucky I log everything. Often I have had to go out of screen and to my log in order to find what the buffer has long since dropped in order to answer the person.
Also just because there is not sudden action and only talking going on does not mean it is not setting up for action later. IF you read books you know most have a lot of chatter, overview and descussion before there is a war or battle. The latter are the spice in the story and the former is the set up.
Now if we had voice talk in game perhaps some rps might run faster but I doubt it. From the PNP I have done often it still takes a while for folks to fully formulate what their chars are going to do and most talk is setup with the dice and such.
Only in movies and books does the action go smoothly because it's been all edited.
So here's my understanding of Viobane's original post: The main barrier to realistic level based RP in the Keep is the Non-PvP setting and the lack of powerful enough guards to keep the peace if the PvP setting is changed.
Makes sense. Since anyone two or three levels lower than another will basically get his butt kicked, the problem is that there are too many high level characters in the Keep. Even if there were a player based police force, they would not be effective even in large numbers to keep civility unless they were given immediate level 40 status and highly forged items. And where would the RP be in that?
IF, and only IF the PvP settings were given over to rampant chaos, I think the guards in the Keep should be beefed up considerably and be made to respond more quickly to problems within their area. There should be little if any chance of defeating one guard, much less two or more. Also, they should enforce the no weapons in public violently after three warnings.
That whole no weapons in public in the keeps gets to me. Many times Topanga has had to buff in the temple and run to the ruin gate. That, my friend, means her weapons are out in public. And I have threatened another member of my rp in character by baring my weapon, not to use it but just as a threat that I could. In both cases, my characters would be pestered by a guard for no reason. (only if there is pvp in the keep and the guards have to be beefed up).
Jazelle wrote:
Yes many of those who talked to me in tells did leave because they had just started playing were low level chars and were confronted on the road by at least 3 Hunters and basically left the server after they felt they were being threatened and there was no reason to keep their chars.
I had my own run in with several of your guild a while back with a low level char a few years ago. No it was not any of the top Hunters it was some lower ones who as I can tell are not with you guys any more. Still the char was not evil but neutral and did not follow anyone. It was basically "Either you follow who we do or you are a foe and we will kill you." I have several accounts and they did not know it was me. By luck another I think of SOM showed up and started talking to them and I left. I have not played that char since.
I believe this is complete and total ********. If this happened, wouldn't Raven (the leader of The Hunters) have been told, complained to, etc.? From my experiences with The Hunters, unwarranted killing would end up getting you removed from The Hunters. It has happened before and would not be tolerated.
What an opportunity for RP from you Jaz! Why didn't you meet with Raven and see about having someone removed? Lost opportunity to RP I say. OR........most likely you pick and choose who you want to RP with and exclude others you dislike. Instead of keeping stuff IC, and addressing it with the leader of The Hunters, you probably just complained to a DM! That is a fault on your part. Why didn't you do something proper to keep all these people The Hunters ran off? Now you just bring it up over a year later? ***?
Now, what seems more likely to me is, YOU were being a total jerk to someone who you couldn't tell their level and you got spanked and made to shut your mouth. That's why you stand around the tree so you can talk a bunch of trash without immediate repercussions.
And the flames they are a gettin' hot! Keep it to PMs and keep it clean folks. Topic locked.
"Common sense is not so common" -Voltaire
"I thought to myself 'Why doesn't someone do something about that?' ...And then I realized I'm someone" - Lily Tomlin (when commenting on the environment and other tragic circumstances)
The Hunters have been considered bullies by many and while it is justified in limited fashion, there is a bigger picture.
In all fairness:
It is true that some groups have been more PvP oriented than others. While the Hunters have been called bullies by some and may have over-done it from time to time, the Hunters were generally true to their purpose as RP vigilanties.
With a server like BSK it is benifitial to have a group like the Hunters who do not sweetly count to five when dealing with knuckleheads. While they were heavy handed at times, their presence on the server did provide a reliable player based check against idiots.
Communication with Raven on the concerns regarding her members could not have numbered many, because I know that most complaints against the Hunters (there were not many) that were made to the DM's... we determined that either both parties needed to relax or the person complaining had asked for the hassle they recieved.
The major problem with the Hunters was that they were generally ready to PvP and they often came on strong verbally and other players were intimidated by that. Some people would attack first, hoping for an edge and assuming (wrongly) that the Hunters would just attack them anyways. This is not so much a 'Hunter problem' as it is a perception that creates a situation that others feel is hostile and overreact.
Speaking for myself, I had several characters who interacted with Hunters and one thing always seemed to prove true: If I did not talk trash or strike first, they did not attack me. While they did often come on strong and while they did try to indimidate... duh... that's the type of characters they play: Good guys with a chip on their shoulder.
Sure it was frustrating sometimes, but then.... I had the choice to tell them I was uncomfortable with the RP and go my own way or log off, but I chose to play it out and generally enjoyed myself.
The problem I have with the terminology is that the term -Bully- applies different in different situations.
It seems bully is interpreted as 'mean, trouble making and a burden to the server'.
As the term applies to the Hunters, the word "bully" would be better defined as 'intimidating and willing to respond with force'.
I think if that change in terminology is used in the above posts, they make more sense.
) IC.
LoT-zine©