PvP in the keep

[BaskingDemon]

Option 1 looks real shiny to me.

Hand up, chalk me down on that one.

[Queen Naga II]

I would not mind either option.

I do however think it is not possible to have one area such as the keep, (in option 1), that can be non PP. I believe that is mod-wide or global choice without having the current non-PvP setting as per the arena if you see what I mean as it is a separate area although within the Keep.

The option that is achievable in the Keep is to raise the spot for the area so high that every attempt is spotted, but that fails to stop stuff being taken and does not stop the griefer PP'er to ruin RP etc...

But Myle your right the main bone of contention is the PP aspect that will become rife in the Keep. Party PvP may stop some of the grief PK's too, I would rather every character had a subdual token which has been discussed in the past I believe.

A subdual token would satisfy those that want to PvP and those that don't won't die from PK'ing griefer.

[Pretty Fly White Guy]

i'd go for option 1 personally.

[Shadow_Nightfall]

option 1 seems well thought up, but what about gold? id hate to loose gold on account of RP, but xp doesnt matter to me.

still, the 1st option is too good to pass up.

[Whitewolf]

I vote to leave it as it is.


I thought this issue was dead like my mage.

its surprising a RP lite server, has so many RP persons pushing to change it.

I am not a hardcore 'hack n slash' player, but this issue is like beating a dead horse.

its ok to take off PVP in the keep for you all that have 40 epics. but the vast majority of visitors do not. This is a totaly lop sided argument.

[Thanatos]

Yeah, I"m gonna go with that option up top. Especially since I had to lure some idiot that wouldn't leave us alone, into the arena, and lay some smack down.

Would've been nice to just be able to take care of said idiot on the spot, without having to leave my bench unattended.

[Rune Brodersen]

Of those two options i would have to vote for nr. 1. But even then i think its lame. If it was up to me i would allow -everything- in the keep. There are people who have spent YEARS making their characters what they are, and it is only fair they are stronger than others *nods*
Of course people should be able to rp, but the whole thing about "we want a place where nobody execpt DM's can harm us" is dumb. There will allways be a chance you might get hurt in the world of nwn, and BSK especially. And to disable fighting and stealing in town, where it would otherwise be most likely to happen, just doesnt make sense to me.
For those of you around here who want to rp only, buy yourself into the den or find somewhere you CAN be alone, seriously.
For the newcommers to BSK, suck it up. There is no way you will be on equal terms with those who have played there longer. As it is right now, any newcommer could come up to a vet, say Raven, and act as if Raven was a worm beneath their boot without fear of the consequences. THATS WRONG. The vets are stronger and better connected outside the keep, why not within? ( I only used Raven because that is a veteran char i assume most people know, it could have been others).
I dont believe people should be able to avoid the pvp settings in town, I am tired of noobs acting tough and ruining it for the vets, just because they cant be harmed in town!
IF you are afraid of getting PP'd, get spot! Theives thrive in big cities, and they should be able to do that in BSK as well. Driller even made a theives guild of NPC's!
If thats not enough, then maybe it is possible to make a script for the guards in town that will enable them to see any failed (or spotted) pp attemp so they can hunt the theif? Or maybe just make guards dislike failed PP'rs?

And to those of you who think it will ruin rp, you obviously didnt play on BSK before it turned into what it is now. RP was better, and whats even more important, EVERYONE was involved! And you know why? because Blackstone was a tough place to be and you needed freinds. be it in a fight or in pure RP.

Honestly, how many of you have heard the phrases "I miss the old days", "RP sucks these days" or "BSK is getting boring"?
I know i have.

Thats my opinion.

[Whitewolf]

Honestly, how many of you have heard the phrases "I miss the old days", "RP sucks these days" or "BSK is getting boring"?
I know i have.

If the only thing eveyone that has an account on the forums wants RP. then change the server info to RP heavy.


problems solved.

RP has nothing to do with bashing peoples heads in that you dont like in the keep. If pVP in the keep is what you all like, petition for it here and make a change..

I remeber the 'old days' when I was greifed so much I left. was not fun having dead charaters all over the road. I am sure it has happend with many b4 too.

there is no connection between PVP in the keep and your abilitie to RP. If it is , there is a problem with ones imagination.

[Rune Brodersen]

[/quote]there is no connection between PVP in the keep and your abilitie to RP. If it is , there is a problem with ones imagination.


Exactly! and that is also why i think the no-pvp and pp in town is just stupid. If anything it ruins rp.[/quote]

[Roland Deschain]

Honestly, how many of you have heard the phrases "I miss the old days", "RP sucks these days" or "BSK is getting boring"?
I know i have.

If the only thing eveyone that has an account on the forums wants RP. then change the server info to RP heavy.


problems solved.

RP has nothing to do with bashing peoples heads in that you dont like in the keep. If pVP in the keep is what you all like, petition for it here and make a change..

I remeber the 'old days' when I was greifed so much I left. was not fun having dead charaters all over the road. I am sure it has happend with many b4 too.

there is no connection between PVP in the keep and your abilitie to RP. If it is , there is a problem with ones imagination.

I think you completely missed Rune's point what I believe was meant is that bringing PvP back to the keep will bring in more RP, No one is saying that we should change the server to Heavy RP because that is not what this server is about.



Sure Rp has something to do with bashing someones head in. If I am RPin ohh lets say a sheriff type character and someone breaks a law and refuses to settle the matter in the way I deem fit then they get smacked around. That is the rp of an authority figuare in the time frame that BSK most relevantly falls into.

"dead characters all over the Road" ???? We are talking about the keep changing PvP status not the road, there can be dead bodies all over the road as we speak

[Rune Brodersen]

*nod* *nod* exactly.
What I meant was that the no-pvp in town ruins it for both rp and fighters. It simply doesnt make sense that the main city is no-pvp in BSK.

[Gahani]

I have watched this discussion for some time now and it seems to be interminable. Perhaps that is because there is no one solution that can satisfy everyone. On a server like BSK you can find players who are looking for hardcore RP and ones who want to hack'n'slash..... as well as everything in between those two extremes.

What needs to happen is the focus needs to be narrowed somewhat. This is what is meant by RP lite... it is a way of telling players who want hardcore rules and such that this may not be the right place for them. There is nothing wrong with this...all servers do it in one way or another.

Unless the focus is narrowed down to one type of play exclusively, there will still be incompatibilities. Either some way needs to be found to accommodate different playing styles or there will be a constant struggle over the "right" way to play. Such arguments are both frustrating and futile.

There are only so many ways out of this impasse. Pick one.

1. Narrow the focus so extremely that the players are a homogeneous group and the argument ends.

2. Continue to allow a wider player base and segregate the extremes to minimize conflict. Essentially allow them their separate playgrounds.

3. Allow the player base to struggle with the question until a dominant faction emerges. Darwinism on a game server will also narrow the focus but will likely lead to a fair bit of unpleasantness.

4. Increase the level of control exercised by DMs and Admin to police the server. Essentially turn BSK into a police state.

5. Find some compromise that will allow the majority their way while protecting the minority. This is quite difficult and will require a fair bit of maturity on the part of players.

I have not addressed the question of PvP in the keep directly because I believe it to be part of a much larger picture. There are no doubt more imaginative people than I who could add to this list The important thing is to ask the right question. Not "Do you want PvP in the keep?" but "What kind of server do you want BSK to be?"

As for me... I have no intention of answering that question.

[Ipsissimossity]

I have watched this discussion for some time now and it seems to be interminable. Perhaps that is because there is no one solution that can satisfy everyone. On a server like BSK you can find players who are looking for hardcore RP and ones who want to hack'n'slash..... as well as everything in between those two extremes.

What needs to happen is the focus needs to be narrowed somewhat. This is what is meant by RP lite... it is a way of telling players who want hardcore rules and such that this may not be the right place for them. There is nothing wrong with this...all servers do it in one way or another.

Unless the focus is narrowed down to one type of play exclusively, there will still be incompatibilities. Either some way needs to be found to accommodate different playing styles or there will be a constant struggle over the "right" way to play. Such arguments are both frustrating and futile.

There are only so many ways out of this impasse. Pick one.

1. Narrow the focus so extremely that the players are a homogeneous group and the argument ends.

2. Continue to allow a wider player base and segregate the extremes to minimize conflict. Essentially allow them their separate playgrounds.

3. Allow the player base to struggle with the question until a dominant faction emerges. Darwinism on a game server will also narrow the focus but will likely lead to a fair bit of unpleasantness.

4. Increase the level of control exercised by DMs and Admin to police the server. Essentially turn BSK into a police state.

5. Find some compromise that will allow the majority their way while protecting the minority. This is quite difficult and will require a fair bit of maturity on the part of players.

I have not addressed the question of PvP in the keep directly because I believe it to be part of a much larger picture. There are no doubt more imaginative people than I who could add to this list The important thing is to ask the right question. Not "Do you want PvP in the keep?" but "What kind of server do you want BSK to be?"

As for me... I have no intention of answering that question.

Though I agree with you based on the premises you've set, I believe that the issue could rather be called a lack of decisiveness. The module is so focused on trying to please all the player groups
- making a module with properties that accommodate everyone -
that it no longer has any particular focus/property. With this I believe that the players' enthusiasm will come to a halt, simply because everyone gets something, so everyone expects to remain satisfied. And since they've been content hitherto, while their demands have grown, they'll eventually make demands that can't be met
- due to the server administration's wish to please everyone, thus having to meet the demands of both sides - and eventually this means that someone won't get it 'their way'.

In short; since this server doesn't aim to please one specific group of players, the probability of encountering displeased players increases as the server's population develops, not only in proportion, but also in demands - the latter being a natural progression as the players persist.

Basically we'll always have some displeased players. The day we stop having displeased players, we will, in all probability, no longer have players.
However, if you want to make an omelet, you've got to break some eggs.

[Gibbo]

There are more choices and options in this thread than on the McDonald's Dollar Menu!

[Gahani]

See...told ya there were more imaginative people out there.

Basically we'll always have some displeased players. The day we stop having displeased players, we will, in all probability, no longer have players.

Another whole take on the problem... more diversity equals an interesting server. As the server approaches homogeneity, as the player base becomes the same, the server becomes less interesting.

Homogeneous player base = dull and dead
Diverse player base = interesting and alive

So our friend here has led us to another question:

"What are you willing to do to maintain a more diverse player base?"