Valnir wrote:welll... that sounds like a good idea. But it seems like bsk has iit own set of rules on ab and ac. AC will be much lower on bsk then in any test mod.
i personally play around with that excel sheet and work the builds out there, then maybe i'll test it in a test mod. Problem is that most of the monsters and weapons you meet/find are totally different on pw's.
Builds that did really good on some pw's totally suck on other. I blame high dr on bsk And maybe the dozen of prestige classes.
Although i like to play with prestige classes, i was used to play with only a few of them and all the basic classes. Most of my current pc's on bsk are with basic classes only. Only my Bladecaster has wm and that only till lvl 7.
The rules on BSK are the rules of Bioware's game. The only difference is the limitation put on how much AC and AB you can forge to items.
The stacking rules of AB and AC are not changeable in the mod. In the Halls of Training you can build +6 AC items and just set them on the floor or put them in a show by editing the module and resaving it. It helps alot to do that, or you can go buy the +6 items in the stores. That will tell you exactly what your AC will be on BSK.
I also use an excel spreadsheet to write it down on paper first, then I would build it in the module just to make sure all feats, etc. work out just right. I didn't mean to really test out how it fares vs. creatures in the mods. In the Halls of Training though there are creatures that can help you judge your effectiveness (lichs, dragons, and some guy Jung Li Yu, or something like that).
Prestige classes just give other options and more possibilities, but I agree the resistances, immunities, and reduction are quite high. The problem is though to redo or change that would require a total change of all monsters and items. I believe that's why you find BSK2 with less magic.
Personally, for BSK I wouldn't take the 1st level of Rogue until after lv20. You lose some skill points, but you gain 1 AB. Since AB is so hard to get high enough vs. the AC available you need all you can get. I would just drop open locks (unless you did that just for RP), and discipline if you have KD protection.
ST_DM_Myle wrote:
I could tell you about a build that has BOTH the AC and AB over 90 easliy on BSK and is a strength based build dealing enough damage to make DwD quake in thier kegs, but giving away such secrets is unwise.
Myle
Shhhh. Now don't go giving all of the builds away. I used to think the funniest thing was when someone you beat down so bad in the arena would suddenly be building your exact same character (class levels that is), but they didn't take the correct feats or somehow they ended up screwing it up. Now I'm alot more likely to state the build for people.
Like has been said many times before, always go test your build out in "The Advanced Halls of Training" or some other module that allows you to build and test a character quickly before doing it on BSK.
ROFL... BSK has taught me many lessons. One such lesson is that great RP will not always protect you from being killed by someone who builds for power and is intent on turning you into paste.
I have my share of RP builds, but I also have learned to crunch the numbers pretty well. I am not the best builder, but I have my share of tricks. Having the build program helps round out things.
Sometimes that awesome undefeatable build you scratch on a post-it turns out to be a real dud when you crank up the builder and realise you forgot a build-breaking feat.
GoVols- yeah.. I added 1 on the Base AC for the 12 DEX.. completely forgot you need 13 Dex for Dodge!! So.. in the high 60's for a straight fighter... that would get "owned" by most of the higher mobs.. and most certainly by other players. At least before spells. Had my Monk (wiz based monk at 38) in the blood cult this weekend.. his AC is only 64- and he got shredded.
Myle- go figure.. and a Fighter was supposed to be the best at being a "tank"... and can't get to be the best without crossing up with some other classes. Great build by the way.. I have one that's similar, but a dwarf. He's "coming up".. but I'd never be able to afford that dadgum Axe..when he gets high enough to use it!
To be honest.. I'm just getting purely OWNED by the Blood Cult.. and I'm looking to build a character that can take the punishment and then dish some out- my first character on the server, Sugroth.. has an AC of 50 (my first NwN build.. gimme a break)... and THANKS to DM Jaydaan for pulling my ARSE out of the fire about 30 times this weekend!!!
Now granted.. I have him in forged hide armor.. and not all of his gear is forged out to the max.. (except for weapon) BUT.. geez.... a lvl 37 barb/3 FT should have a better chance than that!!!
Seriously though, I'm have some other char builds I'm working on that can max the AC and the AB/Damage.. (like a Dragon mix) but I really don't like to do that.. I like playing straight class, or, classes that mix well for RP reasons. I don't PvP at all.. so.. I've never had to learn to build to counter it. Just want to be able to stand next to ol' Shally and take more than one hit before going down.. and be able to complete all of the quests on the server.
That may not be possible.. I was just thinking (and what spawned this post) that a Fighter base with high AC is/should be a great start- and have the best chance to get the AC up there. And as such.. how high COULD I get it that way? Or was I missing anything...
There are two schools of thought though.. lighter on the AC and the best Weapon/AB... means the MoB won't hang long enough to kill you before you kill it.. (read.. damage is king) and the other side that says ... the longer you stay in the fight.... the better chance you have to widdle them down before they get you...
I just want to be able to fight the Blood Cult (and others) without imitatating an AC that is more akin to a soft stick of butter.
ack...
A Master role player is one who is willing and able to bend their character concept to make the game more enjoyable for all involved. To assist the DM in making the game fun, and to not sow discord. - Gary Gygax
I'm making a fun build right now, i need to test some things. Seeing as no-one has a qlue about what kind of monster type umgah's and ants are.
Going with monsterous humanoids for umgah's and vermin for ants.
Yes i'm making a dexer ranger. High ab and ac. atleast ab i know what max will be 73 max or 69 with dual wielding. But ac should be around 84 or so, unless i change my mind about expertise/improved expertise.
Not for nothing but it is not always about AC. My first melee char has a mere 54 AC that can (and does) run in Nethriss all day. Over the weekend I made some ground on the quests and am up to the Blood Cult.
I had some help on one of them but think that I could have handled myself.
Physical damage is one thing, spells are much another. I went to the Drow city and was forced to leave just as fast.
I'll have to take a trip to the waste lords and see how it goes. I know I can handle 4 runelords at once. I suspect the ones in the waste will smack me down.
One thing that every DEX based character forgets about is that when you lose dodge you lose DEX. Say...when knocked down for instance. Unless you've found an item with knockdown resistance your butt's grass when down for the count, or held. There's a good one. One Bigby's or a hold person or a hold monster (Which does in fact work on people) negates all those wonderful AC points gained through dodge and dex. This means that after Murken's Bigby or Hold goes through, most high level monsters fall to his weeny morningstar. Heehee. His AB sucks, and that's the only way he can defeat most large high level monsters.
Prone creatures are considered flat-footed and therefore lose their Dexterity bonus to armor class. Creatures attacking a prone individual with a melee weapon get a +4 to their Attack Roll. However, characters attacking a prone individual with a ranged weapon get a penalty of −4 to their Attack Roll.
But uncanny prevents the loss of ac so the only bonus for the one that deals out the knockdown is the loss of dodge ac of the enemy and the +4 ab to hit. so this would be a max +24 ab, if the enemy had +20 dodge ac that is.
This link describes it pretty well - In addition to losing dodge ac, all tumble ac is lost as well. See the notes listed near the bottom of the linked page.
so you retain your dex bonus to ac, but dodge and tumble are lost. So this could be up to 28 ac lost when knocked down with a dexer that has uncanny dodge.
*stares at the large quantity of stats and information*
*blinks*
*continues staring at the large quantity of stats and information*
Wow....I've been playing NWN for years (minus that couple year hiadus) and never even bothered with all of that research. I used to play on a 20 lvl capped server and my fighter build was pretty good there (no prestige classes). But I hadn't even considered some of the possibilities you guys have rattled off. Of course I never paid much attention to the prestige classes anyways. So props to you guys. I'll have to pay closer attention to some of those other classes and what not next time
Fact: Ninjas are mammals
Fact: Ninjas fight ALL the time
Thanatos wrote:*stares at the large quantity of stats and information*
*blinks*
*continues staring at the large quantity of stats and information*
Wow....I've been playing NWN for years (minus that couple year hiadus) and never even bothered with all of that research. I used to play on a 20 lvl capped server and my fighter build was pretty good there (no prestige classes). But I hadn't even considered some of the possibilities you guys have rattled off. Of course I never paid much attention to the prestige classes anyways. So props to you guys. I'll have to pay closer attention to some of those other classes and what not next time
LOL... people tend to learn what they feels applies to thier needs.
The first character I played here at BSK took me over 9 months to get to level 40. I remade the character with a novice bit of munchkinism for UMD and tumble in "only" 3 months.
The one real PvP build I made I was able to crank out in less than a week.
Of course it helped that by then I had a good feel for the server and I did not bother with RP at all with the PvP build.
I still think back to that first character and shake my head... 9 months.... now it just seems crazy to take so long. BUT... the important thing is I had a blast.
<--- Still waiting to reach lvl 40. Been more than 9 months. Too bad I keep making new characters. There IS hope, though. My highest level character is up to 32 now!
I've never been one to worry about power-builds. After all, in many cases, some builds work better than others against certain opponents. For me the RP is better than the number crunching. I'm here to play a character, not the statistics. When I need to, I can use the NWNwiki to lead the way
So True.. So True.. took from Feb to Sept last year to get Sugroth to 40th.. and about the same for my other lvl 40.. but I got bogged down like Viobane .. kept bringing on new characters-
I just wanted to try every class.. to challenge my RP...and get into different situations.
It all keeps coming back to AC though.. and getting pwnd at the higher levels!
A Master role player is one who is willing and able to bend their character concept to make the game more enjoyable for all involved. To assist the DM in making the game fun, and to not sow discord. - Gary Gygax
And maybe the dozen of prestige classes.
LoT-zine©
